Being a Lamont isn’t about the name, it’s about the blood.
In timing with Scott Turner’s discussion around Septs this past AGM I thought it appropriate to republish an article featured in THW from 2014. Septs are always a popular topic when trying to understand how we fit in the historical picture. Enjoy and feel free to engage in the discussion.
Based on 190/285 (67%) of Single & Family CLSNA Members (2014 data)
Septophobia
I was moved to write this article after a recent email exchange with a member who was suffering from what I like to call “Septophobia”. I define Septophobia as a condition where someone feels inferior due to their Sept name. More specifically, the fact that they are not a Lamont in name makes them feel as though they don’t really belong. The fact is that the majority of us who claim kinship with the Clan Lamont do not bear the Lamont surname. Most bear what is called a “sept” name while even more bear non-traditional names acquired through marriage both recent and in the past. Does that make those not bearing the name Lamont any less entitled to be Clansfolk? Not at all. It never did in the past and it certainly doesn’t mean that now. Clans are like any other family where blood relatives often have different names. So if you are thinking that you are somehow less entitled because you are of a sept, I leave you with the immortal words of Hector McKechnie, “Within a generation the clan will only live in it’s septs and branches.”
Within a generation the Clan will only live in it’s septs and branches.
That answers that question. He wrote that line in 1935 in his authoritative history of The Clan Lamont. Fast forward almost 80 years and it couldn’t be more true. The “Clan” exists because “We” exist and evolution in our thinking is necessary for it’s growth and survival.
Branches, Colonies, and Septs
Since the time of Chief’s, Cadets and Barons in our Clan there have been Branch’s and Septs. The branches were the colonies of Lamonts in the world (other than the lairds). The septs are those not Lamont by name, yet within the Clan Laomainn. The so-called Lamont diaspora of our modern age is not a recent phenomenon and has actually been growing since the 14th and 15th centuries.
We know from record that there were Lambs in England around 1700, Land(l)esses in Paisley, and Mclnturners or Turners in Luss of Loch Lomond . There were Lamonts in France in 1460 (afterwards Barons de Lamont). In 1483 there is record of them in the Braes of Mar, later kenned as Mcllleduies or Blacks. From 1507 there were Lamonts in Skye, and from 1539 in Ayrshire. About the Reformation they are said to have gone to Tiree, and in 1582 again to France and to Holland. They fled from the Diarmaids to Mullin 1646. Buchanan of Auchmar recorded in 1723 that these were assumed as septs—the “McLucases or Lukes, Mclnturners or Turners, McAlduies or Blacks, Mcllwhoms, and Towarts.”
The Sept names we use today are pulled from that same recorded history largely in part to the work of the before mentioned Mr McKechnie. It’s impossible to say how many Septs are actually missing from record.
The Sept names branded Lamont that we all have known have stood for a very long time with a little update here and there. In order to either expand upon or attempt to update what we know would take a team of dedicated researchers not to mention decades. If I may quote Mr. McKechnie just one more time…
For these folk (Septs) to be treated as they ought is beyond the capacity of an individual. Seven-leagued boots would he need in his researches, and time must stand still for him to write.
Anthrogenealogy
We may never get to the bottom of it through research. In the end it may take science. Anthrogenealogy is the science of genealogy by genetics; especially utilizing molecular biology to trace a lineage beyond the limits of historical records. Y-DNA can assist family historians by showing the path of a lineage to connect unknown family members by comparing specific regions of the DNA we inherited from our fathers.
DNA surname studies are based on Y-chromosome DNA, which is possessed only by males. It is passed from fathers to sons virtually unchanged over hundreds of years. Therefore, direct participants in DNA surname studies necessarily must be males. Direct participants in our particular study, that is, people who are actually tested, must be males either: carrying the Lamont or Sept surname descended directly in an unbroken male-to-male line from a Lamont or Sept surnamed male.
The Rest Of Us
What about the rest of us? For those who have a relationship through a grandparent or more distant relative it’s still good old fashioned research. I couldn’t help wondering though, “What would our surname grouping would look like if we incorporated all we do know today?” By that I mean, if we included all of today’s surnames of connected traditional families or not. The cloud below shows the dominate names for the entire CLSNA member base (2014 Data). The larger names represent the highest number of members with that surname with the smaller ones the least. You can compare this chart with the traditional cloud on the top image and make some interesting conclusions. Brown tops the list both times in terms of traditional connections and current naming.
Based on Single & Family CLSNA Members (2014 Data)
I don’t have a set of the “Seven-leagued” boots but I think with a little effort we might learn more about how people are connected.
Thank you for the interesting information. I am related to Harriet McLimons Kinne, on my father’s side. She lived in Wisconsin and her father Hugh McLimons was from Pennsylvania. I was told they descended from the Lamont’s, but I have no documentation of that. I have quite a few Scots and Irish in my tree. Laura
Thank you Laura. It’s often difficult to do the footwork of proving a connection. Trust me, I know first hand! If they come via Pennsylvania I’d be willing to bet you are part of the Appalachian Settlers genetic cohort. Many Scottish-Americans are.
Just remember that proving a connection isn’t a prerequisite to belonging. In fact, supporting you on your journey of discovery is a major part of our mission.
Let us know how we can help!
Your response is much appreciated. I will do more work on my McLimons line and see where it takes me. Do you know when there may be another group meeting ? Just curious. Thank you, Laura
There is a Y-DNA project out there not that is doing estimations on age of DNA lines. It indicates mine started sometime after 1000 ad.
We could use some more men that have taken at least the Y-DNA 67 marker test to join. Currently at my 67 marker I have 2 Lamonts, 2 Browns, and 1 each of Lamond, Williams, Thompson, and Douglas. From this list only 2 of us have joined the group doing their ancient tracking.
Just got an updated ancestry.com result that puts me at 60% Scottish, which was a bit of a surprise. About 150 years ago some in my family changed the spelling of Lamb to Lamm, and my paternal ancestors were definitely part of the West Virginia settlers via southwest Pennsylvania. Interesting stuff! Excited to learn more.
Thanks for the comment Jeff.
That’s a good amount of Scotch! I’m only 38% with an equal portion (another 38%) English. Can I total those for 72% Islander? LOL! Mine makes sense for my research that has Patton’s in England for nearly four centuries prior to migrating to Edinburgh area in the mid 16th century. The Patrick side (my Lamont side) firmly traced to Argyle area a generation after the massacre. The research is so important and even better if it (and the oral traditions) can match up with the blood tests.
I am curious though Jeff, with a name like Lamm, why was 60% Scottish a surprise?
I’ve just always assumed since it was German for lamb that we came from somewhere in Germany, as I really had no idea of any family history outside of my mother’s Irish background. My parents were from West Virginia and grew up poor, there were no obvious cultural traditions practiced. But of course the more I learned about it the more things made sense, the bluegrass music, the folk dancing, even the Pittsburgh area accents- all connected. Fun to find out the truth and how much of it lines up with historical events.
Hello, since posting a comment in August I have done more research, trying to figure out my Donald McLimans ancestry. He was born circa 1700, Ross Cromarty, Scotland, and married Ann, they had son-William George McLimans born circa 1736 in Scotland, who died May 20, 1777 in Berkeley, West Virginia. There are so many different name spellings, and I do not now if they had any connections to the Lamont’s. I am pretty much a novice at this and would appreciate any information anybody might have. My Great Grandmother was a McLimans. Thank you
And your blogs are very interesting. Laura Marems
Hello, interesting blog. I didn’t realize my surname (Lamb) was a branch of Lamont. Thought my family was from Scotland, but really wasn’t sure. Thanks.
Where can I get information about the DNA testing project?
Thanks
The DNA Project focuses mainly on Y-DNA, the only company the offers this if Family Tree DNA. They offer several levels of testing, the best starting is the Y-37 test and then you can upgrade after that if you chose to.
If you have more questions you can reach and ask away, I am the project administrator.
Have my DNA analyzed and it shows paternal haplogroup is R-M417. 99.1% Northern European. Have a note written by my GGGFather that indicated they migrated from Scotland in 1868. Last address in Scotland was in Leith.
While Blaikie is not a common name in the US, it seems it is more common in Scotland. Anyway, my my dna be part of the Lamont clan? What do I need to do to make a connection?
Have my DNA analyzed and it shows paternal haplogroup is R-M417. 99.1% Northern European. Have a note written by my GGGFather that indicated they migrated from Scotland in 1868. Last address in Scotland was in Leith.
While Blaikie is not a common name in the US, it seems it is more common in Scotland. Anyway, my my dna be part of the Lamont clan? What do I need to do to make a connection?
I have a couple of questions for you. What company did you do your DNA test with that gave you the R-M417? Have you researched you GGGfather on Ancestry.com or better yet Scotlands People site. In Scotlands People there are 7 Blaikie in the Leith district https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/.
Most men from Western Europe are R-M269 but that in itself is not conclusive.
Blackie is a known Sept or clan Lamont and when researching use phonetics not so much spelling
My last name is Turner all our lives we thought we were German and Irish. Turns out we are well over 50% scottish apparently we have lamont roots through a sept as well as Taylor which was a Sept of clan cameron. It’s crazy how many years we didn’t know.
My name is Chris not Cjris lol
I was born in Glasgow with the surname Lamond. My father, and his extended family, are all from the Paisley area. We emigrated to the US in 1948. DNA results show me as 87% Scottish and 13% Irish. My mother’s family were Scots Irish (Beattie) who came back to Scotland from Ireland in the 1800’s so my 3rd great grandmother, Jane Kelly, is one of the sources of that 13%. I’d love to know how the Lamond Sept is related to the Lamont clan.
Hello Aileen!
You may not be aware of the “can o’ worms” this surname opens with regard to the Lamont’s. This would require a full essay to unpack but here are some thought starters on what we know from our archives. There would be some debate amongst scholars if “Lamond” is really “technically” a sept of the Clan however, there is no doubt you are family and here is why:
The Origin of Lamond:
The Surname of Lamond is thought to be descended of Lamond Oneil, a son of the great Oneil, provincial King of North Ulster. The chiefs of this Surname were allied with very honourable Families both in Scotland and Ireland, as with the Families of Argyll, MacDonald, Luss, Buchanan, Okyan, lord Dunseverin, and other Families in Ireland. The spelling of Lamond with a “d,” is medieval. “Lagman” was the original version, which is pure Norse and suggests that Sir LAUMAN’s mother was a daughter of Somerled. “Lawmond” was the next, and was the type from 1400 to 1600. Then “Lamont” came in and that prevailed in Cowal as the spelling.
However, that doesn’t mean that’s where YOUR branch of Lamond descended from. Here’s more…
Around 1400 there was a dispersment of Lamont’s as a result of the King’s displeasure at the “Ardyne raid” as it was called. Some sons of ROBERT V, the then chief, had to fly the country, and even to change their names, and CELESTIN VI, the eldest, apparently never succeeded. One became a “Bourdon” and from him were descended the Bourdons lairds of the Feddal in Perthshire, who are now extinct, and perhaps also the Lamonts of Skye. Another went to England as a “Lamb,” and a third to Paisley as a “Land(l)ess.” The last was the progenitor of the McInturners or Turners in Luss of Loch Lomond. About the middle of the century there were perhaps Lamonts in France (who were afterwards the Barons de Lamont), and by the end of it they were certainly in the Braes of Mar in Aberdeenshire, having gone there as an escort to a Lamont lady’s marriage. The latter assumed the name “McIlleduie,” or Black, until about 1700 when they reverted to “Lamond,” then out of fashion in Argyllshire, and they spell it with the “d” to this day. The Blacks were a sept of the clan from an early but unknown date.
It will require deliberate and dedicated family research to find the ties that can connect you to either a specific branch or sept. However, as I said, there is no doubt you are Lamont.
My Grandfather was a Blakeman and his parents were said to be from Scotland….He said we were of the Lamont Clan. I weave and thought I could arrange the tartan. Is this allowed?
Victoria